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BBS Hatching

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Post Wed Oct 12, 2005 12:40 pm
sosnarfy User avatar
Level 8 Member
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Posts: 1167
Location: Portland, OR
Okay, so what the hell am I doing wrong? No matter what I do, I cannot get baby brine to hatch for me, unless I purchase the pre-packaged, pre-salt-mixed stuff. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I have been using one tablespoon aquarium salt per liter of water. I've been bubbling the water in a two-liter, clean pop bottle. I keep light on it 24-hours/day and keep the water in the upper 80's. Not one single egg hatched in my last attempt. I'm using the same brine eggs that the MAS has been selling. Apparently, I'm a BBS dumbass. :roll: HELP.
~D

I miss my fish.

Post Thu Oct 13, 2005 8:40 am
tg MAS Board Member
MAS Board Member

Posts: 147
Location: Wyoming, MN
Maybe your water has too low a PH. I don't know this would cause 100% failure, but if you are using aquarium salt that comes in a cardboard carton, or water softener salt, it may simply be NACL and adds no hardness, and mixed in your soft MPLS water you might have poor results.

If I recall the legandary Nordby had this problem with his WBL water.

Marine salt mix adds lots of hardness & raises PH: maybe this is what you'll have to use.

Some use sodium bicarbonate (baking soda) to add hardness to their water.

I'll bring some marine salt to the BOD.

tg

Post Fri Oct 14, 2005 12:18 am
Kolopedo User avatar
Level 11 Member
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Posts: 2508
Location: Crystal, MN
I agree......Hard water is needed for optimal results...I have tested this and it is very true! I hatch mine using aquarium water (pH=8.4). Dani, you didn't mention using dechlorinated water. That could also be the cause if you aren't using it!
-Tom C.

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Post Fri Oct 14, 2005 8:03 am
sosnarfy User avatar
Level 8 Member
Level 8 Member

Posts: 1167
Location: Portland, OR
I treat our tap water with Prime before using it for hatching BBS. It could very well be the soft water, I have no doubt that you are both correct. Our water comes out of the tap with a Ph of 8.0. That immediately starts to crash, indicating to me that there isn't much buffering capacity of the water. I'll give the marine salt a try and see how that works. Thanks Tom and Tom! :)

I still wonder how the heck we get our africans to spawn in this water... :roll:
~D

I miss my fish.

Post Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:45 am
paisleydals Level 9 Member
Level 9 Member

Posts: 1973
Location: St. Paul, MN

Brine shrimp are not seemingly fussy about the water, so yours ought to be fine. I use my crappy soft polluted water straight from the tap, adding nothing at all except a T of rock salt to a 1 1/2 litre jar - and I don't measure that either. John Alegre said "Chlorine is your friend" when doing brine shrimp and blackworms, and that seems to be true.

I add a cup of water to the jar, throw in the salt, nuke it to boiling to hasten the salt being dissolved, fill the jar right from the tap. The water will be warm. I stir in the eggs - which I keep in the freezer - set the jar on the counter overnight, and drop in the airstone the next day.

Are you sure your eggs are fresh? Brine shrimp eggs need to be kept cold/cool and dry. Jenny swears that putting a light on the hatchery results in a better hatch, but mine hatch on a dark shelf just fine.

I think that it's the quality of the eggs that makes the biggest difference. My hatch rate on small packages of lfs eggs was dismal. The cans that Tom sold at the MAS meeting are wonderful. (I keep mine in the freezer)
Sign me -
Compulsive Hobbyist

Post Tue Oct 18, 2005 11:21 am
sosnarfy User avatar
Level 8 Member
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Posts: 1167
Location: Portland, OR
Yeah, still no luck even with the marine salt. I pulled water from one of the tanks this time. I'll try un-treated tap water next. I've had a light shining on the hatching container 24 hours a day. I'm using the BBS can that Tom sells at the MAS meetings. These eggs are kept refrigerated. I'll keep trying! :) I'm doing something wrong or something.
~D

I miss my fish.

Post Sun Oct 30, 2005 7:24 pm
Passionfish Level 20 Member
Level 20 Member

Posts: 12039
Location: apple valley, mn
How much aeration are you using?

What is salinity of the water?
http://www.petsolutions.com/Search.aspx
or you may borrow mine.

I purchase eggs from Brineshrimpdirect. Here are their instructions. Of course I do not follow their instructions. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Hatching Brine Shrimp Cysts
Instructions and Guidelines
Below you will find the Web's most complete and simple-to-follow brine shrimp hatching instructions!

Storing Brine Shrimp Eggs
First of all, you need to start with healthy, properly stored eggs. All brine shrimp eggs need to be stored as follows:

in a tightly sealed container;
free from moisture; and
in a cool environment at or below 50°F. (Refrigeration is ideal; freezing can lower metabolic activity and delay hatch-out.)
The above storage guidelines apply to all brine shrimp eggs, whether in opened or unopened containers.

Hatching Environment
Follow these guidelines for the best results:

Salinity:
25 parts per thousand (ppt) salt solution, or approximately 11/2 tablespoons of salt per quart (or liter) of water. This equates to around 1.018 specific gravity as measured with a hydrometer. Be sure to use marine salt or solar salt.

pH:
Proper pH is important in hatching brine shrimp. A starting pH of 8.0 or higher is recommended. In areas where the water pH is below 7, Epson salt or magnesium sulfate can be added at the rate of 1/2 teaspoon per quart of solution to buffer the hatching solution.

Temperature:
Optimum water temperature for a 24-hour complete hatch is 80-82°F or 26-28°C. Lowering the temperature would result in a longer hatching time. Do not exceed 30°C.

Light:
Illumination is necessary to trigger the hatching mechanism within the embryo during the first few hours of incubation. Maintaining a light source during the entire incubation period is recommended to obtain optimum hatch results and for temperature control.

Aeration:
Constant aeration is necessary to keep cysts in suspension and to provide sufficient oxygen levels for the cysts to hatch. A minimum of 3 parts per million dissolved oxygen during the incubation is recommended. Strong aeration should not damage or hurt the brine shrimp cysts or nauplii.

Stocking Density:
1 gram per liter or quart or approximately 1/2 level teaspoon of cysts per quart is recommended. A higher stocking density will result in a lower hatch percentage.

Hatching Cone:
Flat-bottom hatching vessels should be avoided. Cone or "V" bottomed containers are best to insure that the cysts remain in suspension during hatching. Be sure to thoroughly wash the hatching cone with a light chlorine solution, rinse, and allow to air-dry between uses. Avoid soap. Soap will leave a slight residue which will foam from aeration during hatching and leave cysts stranded above the water level.

Incubation Period:
Generally, the optimum incubation time is 24 hours. Egg which has been properly stored for more than 2-3 months may require additional incubation time — up to 30-36 hours. Oftentimes, eggs will hatch in as few as 18 hours. If a smaller size nauplii (Instar I) is desired, a harvest time of 18 hours is recommended.

Helpful Hint:
Brine shrimp egg is sometimes very buoyant. In order to maximize the hatching percentage, it is sometimes helpful to swirl the water inside the hatching container with your finger once or twice at intervals in the first 4 to 6 hours of incubation in order to knock down eggs that have been stranded on the side of the container above the water-line. After about 6 hours, the eggs are usually well-hydrated and will stay in the water column.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hatching Procedure
The following steps will achieve optimum brine shrimp hatch rates.

Set Up:
Place hatching cone or similarly shaped vessel in well-lit area. Cone should be semi-translucent for ease of harvesting and light transmission.

Add Water:
Fill cone with water and adjust salinity to 25 ppt (parts per thousand). Optimum hatching temperature is 82°F (28°C).

Add Cysts:
Add cysts at the rate of 1 gram per liter.

Aerate:
Provide adequate aeration to keep cysts in suspension.

Hatch:
Depending upon water temperature, cysts should hatch in approximately 18-36 hours.

Harvest:
After hatching brine shrimp, turn off or remove aeration and wait several minutes for the shells and and baby brine shrimp (or nauplii) to separate. Newly hatched nauplii will settle to the bottom of the cone or move towards a light source; the shells will float to the surface. Once separated, the nauplii can be siphoned from the bottom with a length of air tubing or gently drained through the bottom of the cone through a valve, if so equipped.

Rinse:
The warm incubation temperatures and metabolites from the hatching medium create ideal conditions for a bacteria bloom. Rinsing of the baby brine shrimp in a fine mesh net or sieve using clean fresh or salt water is important before feeding them to your fish.

Clean Equipment:
Tanks and brine shrimp hatching equipment should be cleaned and disinfected routinely.
Like a complete unknown

Post Mon Oct 31, 2005 12:32 am
Kolopedo User avatar
Level 11 Member
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Posts: 2508
Location: Crystal, MN
Dani,

Let's start from the beginning.....What kind of hatchery are you using?? I started with that little black box type with the little plastic jar on the top....That one is total crap. I now use the 2 liter bottle type with areation coming in from the bottom. This type works great!
-Tom C.

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Post Mon Oct 31, 2005 3:07 pm
Cichlid Mania User avatar
Level 6 Member
Level 6 Member

Posts: 504
Location: Elk River, MN
Tom, where did you get your bbs hatchery? I'd recommend everyone get the kind Tom has.

Post Mon Oct 31, 2005 7:33 pm
sosnarfy User avatar
Level 8 Member
Level 8 Member

Posts: 1167
Location: Portland, OR
I'll try another batch and take careful notes. I'll post info in the next day or so.
~D

I miss my fish.

Post Mon Oct 31, 2005 11:42 pm
Cichlid Mania User avatar
Level 6 Member
Level 6 Member

Posts: 504
Location: Elk River, MN
I don't know where Tom got it from, I'm thinking Big Al's, but it seems to work like a charm. Just put a cheap 25 watt heater in it and you'll have hundreds of thousands of bbs!

Post Tue Nov 01, 2005 12:33 am
Kolopedo User avatar
Level 11 Member
Level 11 Member

Posts: 2508
Location: Crystal, MN
Yes. ..I got it at Big Al's.....

http://www.bigalsonline.com/catalog/pro ... ry_id=3029

Probably the best 9 bucks I've spent in the hobby!
-Tom C.

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Post Tue Nov 01, 2005 7:28 am
riftlaker Level 3 Member
Level 3 Member

Posts: 70
Location: Iowa
I think you have a bad can of eggs. I suggest you give someone a teaspoon of them and see if they get them to hatch. I have received bad cans before.

Post Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:51 pm
Kolopedo User avatar
Level 11 Member
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Posts: 2508
Location: Crystal, MN
Thats a good idea.....Dani, I'll bring some eggs to the meeting for you on Thursday!!!
-Tom C.

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Post Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:31 pm
sosnarfy User avatar
Level 8 Member
Level 8 Member

Posts: 1167
Location: Portland, OR
I'm pretty confident that my can of eggs is not the problem. I did manage to get ONE batch to hatch out and holy hannah, did they ever hatch out. I haven't been able to duplicate what I did right, so this time, I'm going to take careful notes so I know what the heck to do if I get it right again. My sneaking suspicion is that the temperature is too high.
~D

I miss my fish.

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